Rich Logis, a former voter for former President Trump, appeared in a video message broadcast to the Democratic National Convention on Monday night to say that the COVID-19 pandemic showed him how Trump was “lying about pretty much everything.”
“I believed Trump,” he said. “When the pandemic hit, we needed leadership, but we were given almost nothing. It was a major betrayal to the country.”
Logis described himself as a “full-fledged member of MAGA” and encouraged fellow voters that there was still time to change their minds about whom to cast a ballot for in November.
Guys, I know how easy it is to say “lol what a dumbass” about people like this, but as someone who grew up rural it’s really hard to express the effect of being completely surrounded by a culture that is still suffering from a generational grief of having industry take their resources and destroy their land, only to then take the jobs away and completely abandon everyone to poverty. Years and years of politicians making promises that never came to pass, or never actually helped those people. Republican talking heads like Fox news took advantage of that and pretended to sympathise with their angst, while riling them up by drip feeding other bits of moral outrage, and just magnified the distrust of “city liberals” and “costal elites” over the course of generations. And we all know about the poor education in rural areas!
No matter how much democrats could tell them what votes are in their best interest, it’s really no wonder they wouldn’t believe them. Imagine if War of the Worlds actually happened, then 50 years later a martian showed up and told you that you earthings really need to implement this financial system called gronsnockle and it would make your lives so much better (and also that you’re just a stupid earthling dumbass who doesn’t know what’s best for you).
If Donald Trump’s bullshit is making cracks in the armor that Murdoch and the Nixon legacy has spent so long shoring up, we should be encouraging that. Does anyone really think that insulting people who are trying to change, is a good way to make more people change??
Yeah except I’m from that world and it’s not really how you’re presenting it at all. The real cause here is an extreme rejection of education. If that wasn’t the case, they’d see how Republicans make their lives far harder every time they can. But the truth isn’t important to them. Only feeling indignant and continuing with the same false facts they’ve always worked on.
No matter how much democrats could tell them what votes are in their best interest,
This is what pisses me off. Uh, no, it makes zero sense that they disbelieve obvious facts and cling to nonsensical lies. Being wronged doesn’t absolve you of being expected to think
OCs comment is basically “All the politicians lied to them so it’s totally understandable that they won’t trust Democrats… but blindly follow Republicans”
If any of that was true, rural people would dislike all politicians and industry shills, and vote against them. Not consistently favor the ones who screw them more.
It’s great that some of them finally came to their senses and maybe will drag others with them, but that doesn’t make it acceptable to have doggedly held immoral stances that hurt others in the first place.
rural people would dislike all politicians and industry shills, and vote against them
That’s exactly how Trump came to be President. It’s also why they like the message of small government. They are all a bunch of lying assholes, so better to have the smallest government possible. It’s a message that meshes with god being more important than country, and with 2A. You’ve 100% nailed it.
Well one of the parties offers them a petty sense of revenge and no need to change if you’re an asshole, so that seems that’s all it takes to earn loyalty.
OCs comment is basically “All the politicians lied to them so it’s totally understandable that they won’t trust Democrats… but blindly follow Republicans”
This is why they liked Trump (the first time anyway). The other Republicans say one thing then do another. They saw Trump as actually meaning it. Course it didn’t happen and the ones that see that are bailing.
Trump used to talk a good game, but, well that’s it.
Trump did not “talk a good game.” His grift is painfully obvious to anyone that’s graduated from kindergarten. Him getting elected is just an example of how stupid a sizeable chunk of this country truly is.
I agree wit both of you - Trump talked a good game for people with little education, presented himself as an “outsider who would drain the swamp” of politicians they have learned to distrust, he “said what he meant” (aka insults and bigotry), and was a “self-made millionaire” (something they all aspire to and believe they could be someday). It was a good grift for the population he targeted, as the original commenter said, angry at industry leaving their towns, angry at politicians not helping. You know what PT Barnum said: “There is a fool born every minute”. He said a lot of other applicable things too because he was a successful con man, just like Trump.
When you listen to him now and him 8 years ago, you realize he used to talk about bringing back jobs and industry. He doesn’t do that anymore. I agree people should have been able to see through it then. But now he relies too much on attacks and he’s showing through, so more people can see through it (and from his no results from 4 years, and Jan 6).
Don’t forget religion. Religion is a cancer that encourages you to just trust what you’re being told despite a complete lack of evidence. Religion is also the cause of these single issue voters, like on abortion, where they will vote R simply on the abortion issue alone.
Honestly though, religion is just their scapegoat. While you’re right that it discourages free thinking, I don’t know if a single toxic belief they have outside of homophobia, which has any basis in religion. For example, the Bible says nothing about abortion, except describing one in detail once.
They hide behind their religion. Which is pretty sacrilegious honestly. But let’s not let them pretend God told them to be horrible assholes.
Actually it is as if instead of blaming the parties actually responsible for economic conditions, they embrace their bigotry and the lie that immigrants are responsible. All the Repub politicians reinforce that, but don’t actually do anything that harms the immigrants. Then someone shows up who calls immigrants “rapists and thieves.” They elect him and he really follows through. He changes the conditions at the border to increase the number of illegal crossings. He implements a shockingly cruel policy of separating parents and children, knowing full there aren’t resources to keep track of children, so some will be lost.
Come on you know gronsnockle is going to improve things all the way up the supply chain, evening out the glansblaarg fees is only going to make smeechickle easier and more cost effective- any earthling could see that
I know! Freakin’ glansblasrg fees. Hah? Amirite? I mean . . . Shh.
Didn’t blame me, i voted for Kaang.
I really really want gronsnockle now.
Does anyone really think that insulting people who are trying to change, is a good way to make more people change??
Do you think random people on the internet responding to a thread make a difference?
You have no idea how little it takes to change the mind of a person seeking a reason to grow and learn.
Took you how long to write that one page copout?
What a stupid comment.
OP was illustrating the effect of total media control and propaganda, the local culture it generated with the loss of local resources, poisoned land, and jobs shipped overseas.
Yes, it’s sad that people were able to be brainwashed over generations with 100% captured media giving people a false culture built on lies and deceit.
It’s also sad that people who come to a revelation that they have been taken for a ride, they no only have to accept they were wrong for a large part of their life, responsible for voting to make it worse, and would likely lose their friends/family by rejecting the false narrative that’s been embraced locally.
Even if you hate these people for their situation, you’ll still have to deal with them as voters and members of the population. Hating/confronting them will only push them further right.
We really need to bring the country together, and remove the us VS them mentality the wealthy use to divide us.
You are coping out by literally writing off half your country, refusing to understand the problem, don’t want to address the root causes, and have no interest in resolving the issue.
Do you have any kind of plan aside from blaming the others for all the problems? Because that’s exactly how the wealthy maintain the status quo.
I have a huge amount of respect for people who manage to pull themselves out of the cult and recognize it for what it is.
Seriously, think about how much Logis invested of himself into being a MAGA Republican. These people pour their entire identities into supporting Trump.
Breaking out of it must feel like cutting off their own arm. They’ve got the sunk-cost fallacy, personal ego, and relationships that are built almost entirely on political leanings working against them.
And they know how they’ll be treated by former friends and loved ones, because - to their shame - they know how they treated people who managed to find the exits from MAGA-world.
So a huge amount of respect to Logis for getting out despite the enormous pressure he must have felt to stay in.
Yikes. Then maybe explore how you were so easily duped. That’s the real problem.
It can happen to anyone. You are not immune to propaganda.
Okay but… There’s a difference between being influenced by propaganda and actively ignoring your eyes and ears, And going out of your way to be influenced by a cult of personality
How do you think cults operate? A cult of personality requires insane amounts of propaganda. The type of propaganda that the largest news network in the country provides. The type of propaganda that is effective at reaching vulnerable and disenfranchised people into believing hateful ideology. There have been many smart people that ended up in a cult, because that cult’s propaganda was effective to them.
It also takes a mind unwilling to ask important questions or perform any kind of self reflection. No not anyone is susceptible to this.
I agree. There are plenty of people who are at no risk at all of joining a cult because they are not morons.
They can still get scammed tho. Or just make a wrong choice that has repercussions. It’s a six-of-one, half-dozen-of-another kind of situation.
Right, so not everyone is susceptible which is all I was saying, Jesus
What it seems like you’re saying, both in your previous comment and this one, is that certain people cannot fall into a cult because effective propaganda wouldn’t be effective.
Going out of your way to believe what everyone around you believes? Yeah, that’s hard.
You are not immune to propaganda.
“You are not immune to being convinced by something.”
Nobody should be immune to that. What they should be able to do is distinguish accurate propaganda from bullshit.
That’s not as simple as you might think. You’d be surprised what has been made into “common knowledge”.
It could be simpler than what it is, but teaching critical thinking is very low priority, especially in the US.
This is true for nearly everyone!
However, I have been immunized by media literacy studies, digital literacy practice, reading history, having a healthy respect for the scientific method and a basic understanding of political economy.
You know–what in some jurisdictions is called schooling.
[someconditionsmayapply, immunization does not confer immunity, merely resistance, consult your local poets]
I’m concerned you’re not playing enough sportsball.
lol does throwing chickens back over the fence count?
I have been immunized by media literacy studies, digital literacy practice, reading history, having a healthy respect for the scientific method and a basic understanding of political economy.
Aaaaaaaaand they’re gone. You’ve eliminated every single Republican voter in one single sentence.
You’re still not immune. You’ve been given tools to identify something as propaganda, but propaganda works not just because people lack those skills, but because they weren’t using those skills when they encountered it. Propaganda can come from anywhere, so unless you’re always fact checking everything everyone says, you are not immune to propaganda.
Um, one thing that helps is reading the entire message, including disclaimers…
Also, please don’t try to reduce media literacy to fact checking, you’ll just get hung up on authenticity.
That means the right propaganda could convince anyone, doesn’t mean everyone has 0 defence against it, some have more than others.
No shit? We knew that in the 1990s, how is this news?
Ok, glad he came around to realize Trump is a deceitful fool. My question is what has been learned more generally? Are people like this going to fall for maga2?
Bouncing up and down while repeatedly saying yes. Wtf is Skinner doing?
Explaining steamed hams.
I’m from Utica and I’ve never heard anyone use the phrase ‘steamed hams’.
gifs loop, in case you weren’t aware.
Whaaaaaa???
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At this time of year?
At this time of day?
They either have already fallen for it are never stopped falling in the first place.
No shit, still your fault :)
We should be welcoming the few who are able to say they were wrong and advocate for our side.
I agree but it Doesn’t change the fact that they are directly responsible for it.
Building solutions is harder than casting blame, but it’s also more important.
OK but the doesn’t mean we just let people get away with things lol
What did he get away with? He voted for a candidate he believed in. It was a poor choice from some perspectives, but he apparently knows that now and is advocating for the opposing side. Literal democracy at work.
We should reward this behavior. Punishing bad behavior only teaches people to get better at lying about it. Rewarding good behavior creates more of it.
Will punishing him cause Trump to lose the election he already won?
If your “poor choice” is such a monumental fuckup that you voted in a literal fascist, it’s not a bad choice it’s a moral failing.
You’re missing the point. He did a bad thing. Yes. But punishing him for doing it doesn’t undo the bad thing. Right now we have the chance to praise the good thing: switching sides.
What will get more blue votes: penalizing red votes after they’re already cast, or extolling the virtues of voting blue, especially using cases of those who have seen the value of switching sides?
You’re not wrong that his vote may have caused harm, but he has just as much right to cast it as you have to shun him for it. The real story here is that he learned and is now on a more productive side. We should be celebrating the future, not dwelling on past mistakes.
By far the most important fact is they have stopped actively pulling at the steering wheel to drive us off a cliff.
All else is secondary by a fucking mile. Nobody is saying anything wrong here, we are just much better off picking the best main focus.
But they also invited a bunch of other idiots to pull the wheel, who are still pulling the wheel. They’re directly responsible for that.
It’s always a mix of emotions when somebody realizes something I’ve always known since day one. I wish it would stop happening, I hate being right so often, it’s fucking depressing. I wish more, however, that other people would be smart enough to know a scam when it smacks them upside the head.
True. To be fair it’s a ridiculously low bar.
I want to ask him “what gave it away”? The pandemic in his case, apparently. What was that moment like when he was all “heeeeyyyyyy . . . Wait a minute!”
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Maybe, but I doubt it. More likely Trump’s policies either directly or indirectly (but obviously) affected them personally. Sort of the stereotypical “But you said I was one of the good [minority] people!”
Well I believe it was just George Carlin who said that if a random idiot is off average intelligence, then half the population is dumber than that.
Good to see from this voter.
At this point I can’t tell the difference between the dementia and the intentional deception.
It’s weird that he’s running at all in such a mental state when he should clearly be in care of professionals.
That was the case almost a decade ago and -
gestures to everything
Welcome… to the real world.
</morpheus>
I wonder how many of his friends and family stopped talking to him and how many threatened him with violence.
Here’s a link to the actual video since I didn’t see it in the article or here in the comments.
I guess he’s really starting to regret voting for Trump then.
Cool, cool. Some moron who fell for Trump’s obvious lies and happened to catch on eventually is broadcast at the DNC.
Who is he supposed to be swaying at the DNC? This seems like stupid feel good crap about how “Trump voters can be swayed with logic and reason” when it is obvious this one person does not represent even a tiny portion of the MAGA voting block who are still all in on Trump.
This is how communities break out of bad cycles. You show people who changed their minds, and that encourages fence sitters to also change their minds. Then when those people show that they’ve changed their minds, even more follow.
This is used to push groups towards good polices, and also how mobs get out of control.
If the dems ignore the psychology of large groups, then they’ll never get more than a small percentage of the vote.
https://youarenotsosmart.com/2023/09/14/yanss-269-deconstructing-how-minds-change-with-michael-taft/
They don’t need the MAGA vote or appeal to Republicans, they need to energize those who are either apathetic or who need to overcome voter suppression hurdles. Patting themselves on the back by continuing their moderate bipartisan wish fulfillment fantasies that has let the Republicans obstruct them for decades isn’t going to motivate anyone if it hasn’t worked already.
GOtV is a constant. All day every day. But it has its problems.
People who want to bash the Dems for not being progressive enough will either vote Dem or not, but they are less likely to be swayed by a presentation at the DNC than a centrist.
I’m pretty sure people at the DNC aren’t the actual audience, the cable news crowd is.
The MAGA folks aren’t going to be watching the DNC directly, they will be watching edited clips on fox news. So they aren’t going to be swayed.
The undecided folks who might watch aren’t going to be swayed, at best they might think the MAGA crowd is starting to be reasonable.
I don’t see how including this does anything except show that the Dems still haven’t given up on trying to reach out and connect with the supporters of a coup.
Worked out great after the civil war, so let’s keep trying!
I hear ya, but I think they’re thinking it represents someone getting out.
And, yes, that’s good. Let’s promote that. Let’s win this thing.
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